Kohetsu 800 first impression

[jmcnelly85]

I haven't spent too much time with this stone but so far it's very impressive. Initially, it's a very thirsty stone, my first soak took over an hour to get the bubbles to stop; however, since using it on a biweekly basis the soak time seems to have settled around a half hour. I tested cutting speed by thinning away some cladding on a ss clad carbon, it might not be as fast as a 320 shapton pro, but surprisingly, it's fairly close. The knife leaves a nice contrast; however, it is sensitive to pressure and will leave deeper scratches without a gentle hand. Luckily, it's cutting speed renders that point irrelevant, there is no need for more pressure. It kicks up a good amount of useable mud fairly quick, but not so much that you're left looking like a toddler covered in pudding. I thought the texture on the cladding at this stage would help non stick properties, but it actually gives food something to hold on to, and even squeaks going through tough, tall carrots. Aesthetically, it looks aggressive, but in use, keep going. Following with the 2k stone, all of the scratches are easily converted and it becomes much more fluid through food without sticking or squeaking. I've used the stone starting progressions as well as a finished edge, in progressions, it very quickly produces a surprisingly clean, aggressive edge. The time it takes to get from full to sharp gives the impression that you are going to experience a jagged, gnarly coarse edge; however, spend a little time polishing and you wind up with what could easily pass as a very serviceable edge. Using the edge (lightly stropped on newspaper) with a 52100 artifex, the cutting requires a little push or pull motion on everything but onions; however, it'll hold that edge for longer than I've ever experienced with the ol Clydesdale. What really surprised me was how well it finished German steel, my home meat knife is a wusthof 8in flexible slicer that's more than twice as old as I am and the two seem to get along quite nicely. The edge is carnivorous enough for butcher duty, but refined enough for versatility. Both the 800 and 2k are phenomenal stones, I'm sure Mark is already sick of hearing us badger about getting more stones in this line, now he has one more person on that list. Seeing a 400 and a 4K would certainly find their way in my droor.

[Rufus Leaking]

I bought the last one of these available prior to the new shipment in now. I don't recall who recommended it- I was having problems with blue steel, and the kohetsu stones are the only ones that I can recommend here. They're heads and shoulders above my other half-dozen stones. I snapped up the 2k as soon as it came back in stock, and they are the only thing between my blue steel AS blades and a Rika 5k finish. I don't use them on my White Steel blades, but I do use them on my single VG Steel tojiro DP blade. They're outstanding.

[jbart65]

I've had the 800 and 2000 for a year or so. Excellent stones. As jmc noted, the 800 produces a clean but aggressive edge. Notably better than my Shapton Pro 1000 that was no slouch.

If I am not mistaken, Suehiro makes the stones. I added a Suehiro Cerax 320 and 6000 to complete my lineup.

The 320 does a fine job, but for a low-grit stone, I find it too soft. Dishes a lot and grooves are easily created. Perhaps I am going too hard and not letting enough mud build up (it builds up fast!). I no longer use for hard to deal with knives like German stuff. Best for Japanese knives that don't need much work at low grits.

The Cerax 6000 is much more to my liking. A very refined edge, but like the 800 and 2000, a hint of aggression remains.

[jmcnelly85]

I forgot to mention how these stones feel and sound, the 800 has the more stereotypical "coarse stone" feedback, you can hear the stone eat as it goes. The 2k is certainly smoother with a more pleasant speaking voice. Both stones feel somewhat soft to middle of the road, nowhere near as soft as a green brick but nowhere near as hard as a shapton pro.

[Radar53]

I am new to freehand sharpening, but I bought both these stones on great advice from other forumites and certainly haven't regretted it. I like the feel & feedback that I get, & find the 800 is a real workhorse but leaves a pretty nice finish by using less pressure. The jump to the 2000 was easy and what really surprised me was how aggressively the 2k stone cuts for the finish that it leaves.

[jmcnelly85]

The cutting speed to refinement ratio on both of these stones is absurd. What's really impressing me is how well the 800 has been handling "lesser" steels. I've put 800 edges on both buck and leatherman 440 steels and they're in great shape, with better steel putting the 800 on a 154cm skeletool made probably the best edc edge I've ever created.

[Kit Craft]

I've had the 800 and 2000 for a year or so. Excellent stones. As jmc noted, the 800 produces a clean but aggressive edge. Notably better than my Shapton Pro 1000 that was no slouch.

If I am not mistaken, Suehiro makes the stones. I added a Suehiro Cerax 320 and 6000 to complete my lineup.

The 320 does a fine job, but for a low-grit stone, I find it too soft. Dishes a lot and grooves are easily created. Perhaps I am going too hard and not letting enough mud build up (it builds up fast!). I no longer use for hard to deal with knives like German stuff. Best for Japanese knives that don't need much work at low grits.

The Cerax 6000 is much more to my liking. A very refined edge, but like the 800 and 2000, a hint of aggression remains.

When you say better than a SP1k, how do you mean that? More refined and less aggressive? Or more refined yet more aggressive? I like huge loads of aggression and is one of the reasons I own an SP1k even after all of the stones that I have tried.

[jbart65]

Hard to define, Kit. The 800 edge is quite good. Not as refined as the SP1k, perhaps, but refined and toothy at the same time. I just think it produces a better all-round edge and I like how the stone feels.

Not taking away from the SP1K. Very good stone that I may buy again one day as part of a road set.

[Kit Craft]

Hard to define, Kit. The 800 edge is quite good. Not as refined as the SP1k, perhaps, but refined and toothy at the same time. I just think it produces a better all-round edge and I like how the stone feels.

Not taking away from the SP1K. Very good stone that I may buy again one day as part of a road set.

Hah, didn't take it that way. Stones are things, and I am always looking for a better one! I was curious and now more so after your description. I'll throw one on the wishlist.

[jmcnelly85]

I think how I'd describe the 800 edge is that it's a refined coarse edge. I consider "middle refinement" to be in the 2kish range and "high refinement" as anything 5k and up. While still being in the "coarse" camp, it's somewhere closer to the cutoff for middle refinement than coarser... I can picture a diagram in my head but it's hard to articulate... coarse, medium, and fine each have three X's on each side of them, the C in coarse will be an sp 320, the M is a kohetsu 2k (seems right at 2k, above a shapton pro 1.5, below a green brick) and the F will be a shapton pro 5k... this makes sense?

xxxCxx8xxxMxxxxxxFxxx

[Kit Craft]

I think that makes sense. Less complicated than how I think about it. I tend to think in Extra coarse, coarse, medium coarse etc. Yet then there are characteristics that go with it. Example: Medium coarse yet refined or medium coarse yet toothy. It is hard for me to place "grit" because I have used so many stones where grit meant little to nothing. 800's that were finer than 1500s and 5k stones that were more coarse than 3k stones. Stones that leave a cosmetic finish well above most 6k stones yet an edge that is around 3k. These are synthetics too, naturals are even worse in this sense.